Discussion: The 'Phoenix' files

Squib

House: Gryffindor
Points: 164

Kadyak says:

Strawbeez Girl - I am sure something unexpected will happen with the Veil (which does APPEAR to me to be a transition into the afterlife). I find Virginia's theory unlikely only, though highly, because it seems to me that one of JKR's principle messages is that magic can't solve problems - least of all bringing someone back from the dead. At the same time, Virginia's theory is intriguing, and if there is something to it, I suspect it will be the revelation that being beyond the veil is not exactly being "dead" as we think of it. After all, we never see a dead body. (This would also contribute greatly to Harry's difficulty with accepting the death of Sirius. Given JKR's penchant for twists and for having characters pop up later - often in more sigificant roles - than they had before - we should expect the unexpected when it comes to the veil.

Regarding Umbridge - I told my wife the other day that I suspect that Umbridge is going to join Voldemort, or at least align herself with him distantly.

If my view of things is JKR's, Fudge will be disgraced. He will receive a vote of no-confidence in the Ministry. I don't see how that can't happen. As I observed before, he allowed Umbridge too much power and closed himself to sources of information that would tell him that she was abusing her power - and this is the most lenient scenario. At worst, he outright authorized her to do the specific things she did - and thus was a knowing, willing, collaborator. In any case, he must go. That being the case, she no longer can have a place in the ministry. She must fall with him. Where else is she to go? She could just go her own way, but if she does, I suspect that she would be easily used as a pawn by Voldemort. The other possibility is that she aligns herself with him, closely, or not so closely.

By the way, about your specific questions of what Fudge will believe, if my theory is correct, it would render those question moot when it comes to the direction the Ministry would take. Nevertheless, they are important when it comes to what course Fudge himself will take, because the answers to them would indicate if he can have any place in defense against Voldemort, in or out of the Ministry.

In the end, I think that whatever JKR does with Fudge, it will be of critical importance. She has already described the establishment of a police state at Hogwarts and the overthrow of the same. She can't leave Fudge in office as if nothing had ever happened, or treat it as a giant goof. If she does, that will be the greatest blow to her entire series - a profound inconsistency.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 3:08 AM EST

Student

House: Gryffindor
Points: 279

Abrez says:

any theories abt the next book??? plz!!!

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 6:52 AM EST

Muggle

House: Gryffindor
Points: 58

phoenixfeathers says:

strawbeez girl, maybe Harry uses the time-turner to travel back to the night when Voldemort tried to kill him. Maybe there's something he needs to see to discover how to defeat Voldemort. Also, everytime Harry feels what Voldemort is feeling, his scar prickles or hurts. Is it reasonable to assume that if the scar goes away, the connection between Voldemort and Harry will be broken? Finally, I have a question--are boarding schools really common in Britain?

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 8:48 AM EST

Animagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 19544

Sirius-Ella says:

ok, I have a silly question, James was a pureblood...right? and Lily was umm half and half shall I say? DOES THIS make harry a pure blood...?

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 9:13 AM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 340

Prongs1 says:

In answer to Ima Quidditch Fan prefect Question, I think the prefects chosen in year carry on intill the end of the 7th year, so I dont think Harry n Neville could be made prefects, But I think Ginny will be made be one and Harry 4 Headboy! Fawkes

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 9:45 AM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 340

Prongs1 says:

DRU587, Gryffindo won the house cup in OoP (I think....pretty sure), and there wasn't the house cup comp in the 4th year because of the triwizard thing. Fawkes

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 10:19 AM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1012

Imperio says:

Owlpost- I don't think that Harry will get Head Boy for the same reasons that Dumbledore chose not to give him the title of Prefect. Harry's closest person to a family member just died by the hand of one of Lord Voldemort's supporters that I can see Harry focusing mostly on making himself as powerful as possible (continuation of Dumbledore's Army) for two reasons: one to avenge Sirius' death and the other to make sure that he gets the marks on his N.E.W.T.s so that he can become an Auror. Dumbledore will recognize this and probably opt not to chose Harry for Head Boy. (Hermione I think is a lock however)

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 10:54 AM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 340

Prongs1 says:

I don't think my post worked last time, so here goes againg, DRU587 Gryffindor won the cup in the order of the pheonix (I think.....pretty sure) and in the Goblet of Fire there wasn't the the house cup comp. cos of the Triwizard, really soz if I've already posted this message but I can't see it and you seem so anxious to get a reply. Fawkes

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 11:23 AM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1012

Imperio says:

Fawkes- about the house cup... is there a quote from the text that you can find that says who won the house cup in OotP? I don't think they mention it anywhere.

Also, was I the only one to be sincerely angry at Snape when he showed up just as Harry was about to curse Malfoy, Crabbe, and Goyle... argh How sweet would it have been to see Harry take all three of them... Oh well I can see Harry and Malfoy's enmity growing to a point more like James/Sirius with Snape while they were at Hogwarts where they curse each other with every chance that they get. Anyone agree or disagree?

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 11:30 AM EST

Prefect

House: Ravenclaw
Points: 361

LaDonna says:

Was the house cup even going on in Book 4? I thought everything was put on hold for the Tri-wizard tournament, not just quidditch.
DRU587 -- I wouldn't mind if Neville turned out to be the real hero.
I'm sort of upset that no one thought the one the prophecy was about was a girl. Surely there has to be a family that has at least defied Voldy three times that has a daughter. How does anyone know exactly what year the person the prophecy was talking about? (I know since Voldy marked Harry it means him, but there are other ways to mark people. For all we know Malfoy got a dark mark at birth and that's it {I really really doubt this]) For all we know it could be Ron and Hermione's daughter years from now, that is named Hariett in memory of Harry, who was killed by Voldy. (Though I doubt it. I just thought it needed to be said.)

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 12:09 PM EST

Squib

House: Gryffindor
Points: 164

Kadyak says:

Ohnonotme - As a parent I too was rather disturbed by Harry's persistent anger. As I read and thought, however, I couldn't see how he could be anything other way. DD even points out in the end that it is Harry's powerful goodness that is causing him to be angry about what his happening to him - he cares. He (Dumbledore) even tells Harry that he (Harry) isn't as angry as he should be at Dumbledore himself. It is not the fact that Harry is harboring so much anger that is the problem - the issue is how does deal with that anger. Certainly in Order of the Phoenix, his anger leads him to make a dreadfully poor choice - to not trust in the wisdom of the adults around him, whom he has always found trustworthy in the past. Had he done so, he would have seriously practiced occlumency and not been caught on Voldemort's hook - and Sirius would still be with him. JKR very skillfully makes it clear that Sirius's death is not the fault of any one person. Many people made choices that contributed to him being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Dumbledore recognizes his own in not being more open with Harry from the beginning - for not trusting his inner voice that told him that Harry could handle much more than most kids his age. Harry must face the contribution his own anger played. From there, he must learn how to cope with his anger so that it motivate him, without controlling him.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 1:52 PM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 340

Prongs1 says:

Muggle Wizard, T is the worst standing for Troll, Fawkes

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 2:54 PM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 340

Prongs1 says:

To clear up some thoughts on which houses some of the adults were in, on mugglenet it gives a list of previous members of the houses. It says James was in Gryffindor with Lily(interesting for people who think Harry and Hermione will hook up) and that snape was in Slytherin. oh Dumbledore and Hagrid were in Gryffindor too,so maybe Harry is related to Dumbledore? Fawkes

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 3:21 PM EST

Professor

House: Gryffindor
Points: 1012

Imperio says:

fawkes- I have seen a theory similar to yours of Harry perhaps being related to Dumbledore. First, you only reason to believe this is because Dumbledore was in Gryffindor. That is totally inconsequential there are many people in Gryffindor and it never means that they are related. JKR even showed us that relatives aren't always in the same house (Parvati and Padma Patil). Harry and Dumbledore being related would be too much of a strange coincidence and a little Star Wars-esque. JKR is not going to make them related.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 3:37 PM EST

Prefect

House: Gryffindor
Points: 388

Magellan says:

DRU587 - You posted a while back that you didn't know who won the Quidditch Cup in OP. Gryffindor won the Quidditch Cup, because Ron was being carried by team members and a bunch of Gryffindors, and Ron was carrying the Quidditch Cup himself. Since I don't have the book with me, I can't tell you the page, but it was right at the end of the chapter entitled Grawp, or in the first of the next chapter.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 4:26 PM EST

Professor

House: Ravenclaw
Points: 1086

DRU587 says:

Magellan- I think you misread a post that I put up earlier, asking who won the House Cup, not the Quidditch cup. On the subject of who won the House Cup, I agree with Imperio, because i can't find a place anywhere that states it. You might be able to throw a few lines together and say that it says it here, but that's not really good enough for me.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 4:32 PM EST

Virginia says:

OK, OK, so lots of people don't think that Harry is related to Snape and Dumbledore. However, I do think there is something there that we aren't seeing....I have to agree that Harry should have seen them in the Mirror, but JK has been very cagey about other things, so we'll have to see.

About the heirs to other houses, the Riddles had a big estate before Tom killed them. I realize that he said that his dad was a muggle, but what if it were his dad, not his mom, who was the heir to Slytherin, and he was a squib?

If James is the heir to Gryffindor (and therefore rich from that), then who are the heirs to Hufflepuff and Ravenclaw, and are they rich? How many big estates are left for those "old wizarding families"?

I do not believe that Harry's use of the Cruciatus curse was an accident. Remember that they are not allowed to "practise" the unforgiveable curses, yet to be good at something, you need to practise it (Harry's Patronus). At least Harry now knows that you have to "really" mean it, so he has a clue for when he does need one of these again. I also don't think much will be made of his use of it from a legal point of view; JK has too much of importance to cover in book 6.

To answer another question: I seriously doubt that Neville is the one the prophasy is referring to. I pondered that line for quite a while, and although marked could mean something different, in this case I believe in Albus' reading of the situation.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 5:14 PM EST

Virginia says:

Regarding the prefect system, I think that Head Boy/Girl are in essence a special type of "prefect". I think that they take prefects from 5th and 6th years, so there are more than the 8, there are actually 16. I guess we haven't heard about the other years that much just as we haven't heard about the house cup that much; it hasn't been very relevant from Harry's POV.

I also think Harry must get a grip on this anger of his. It is understandable, but it will lead to serious mistakes and a weakness on his part he cannot afford, especially now. So, he has to learn to control it, maybe use it to drive him toward a certain goal, but NOT control him (Mask of Zorro idea).

I am a little confused about under age wizardry; Hermione uses it before she ever gets on the train in book 1, says in fact that all her practise spells have worked. In Diagon Alley she repairs Harry's glasses for him and doesn't get nailed then, either. Ginny uses brooms when her brothers are gone, and we see little ones using them at the Quidditch world cup? Any inconsistencies here, or is it just me?

Finally, regarding Harry being quidditch captain, I believe he has too much on his plate for that, so I think Ron will get it, as it says in the mirror...

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 5:23 PM EST

Virginia says:

Tadhgain: Snivellus is a nasty nickname for Severus. He has a big nose, after all, and had a nasty childhood, no friends. I believe Muggle Wizard is correct in saying that he had sensative emotions; the Mauraders may have caught him crying at some point. I believe this is what makes Snape the way he is now.

I can't help but wonder if Snape's demeanor is his way of covering for a sensative soul who has had to kill innocent people, may have to still do so to keep his "cover" intact, and this tears him up. Furthermore, if most of the DE come from Slytherin, then it is entirely possible that he will have to kill students/former students of his in the future. If this were your choice, would you care to get close to anyone? I sure as hell wouldn't, and I'd make damn sure no one would want to get close to me, either. No risk there, no one to be used against me as Sirius was used against Harry.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 5:35 PM EST

Professor

House: Ravenclaw
Points: 1086

DRU587 says:

WitchyWays- I disagree on your comment about Dumbledore being made the new Minister of Magic. I remember reading in one of the earlier books that Dumbledore was once asked to be Minister of Magic, but turned it down to stay as Headmaster of Hogwarts. I do believe if the Minister of Magic job opens up in Book 6, Dumbledore will not take it.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 5:41 PM EST

Wizard

House: Ravenclaw
Points: 993

Muggle Wizard says:

fawkes -- Are we sure that the T grade wasn't a joke? I was under the impression that someone (I want to say it was Fred or George) was just cracking a joke.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 6:08 PM EST

Animagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 19544

Sirius-Ella says:

Witchy Ways...I just want to point out that the mirror doesn't show the future it just show their deepest disire, but ron could still get captain...but I don't see anyreason why Katie wouldn't get it

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 6:30 PM EST

Animagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 19544

Sirius-Ella says:

OK anthor DUMB Question, was Mr. and Mrs. Weasley in hogwarts at the time James, Sirius,Pettigrew, And lupin were? or are they younger?

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 6:32 PM EST

Student

House: Gryffindor
Points: 268

Tadhgain says:

Thanks Virginia, but I didn't ask what Snivellus was...lol ;)

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 7:00 PM EST

Student

House: Gryffindor
Points: 268

Tadhgain says:

Siriusella I would go ahead and assume that Mr. and Mrs. Weasley are older than James and co., considering how old Bill and Charlie are(or atleast how old I IMAGINE they are). In book five Percy is what, 19? So which ever is the oldest(can't remember off hand) would have to be atleast in their mid-twenties. If they were they same age as James and co., they would have been like 15 when they had their first kid. I do, however, think that Lucius may have been at school with James, seeing as at the end of OotP he is 41.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 7:04 PM EST

Animagus

House: Gryffindor
Points: 19544

Sirius-Ella says:

Ok, I was reading back on the part where someone was disscussing harry kissing cho, I din't know he kissed her I thought that they just stared at each other, it didn't actually state they kissed each other...or maybe I over read it..can someone tell me or not if they kissed.

Posted Jul 4, 2003 at 8:27 PM EST